UIL wrestling alignment

[jmicheal2333]

http://donbosco.powermediallc.org/2012/ ... g-meeting/

First one that popped up when I went looking for information. I think NJ is a pretty good wrestling state too. If it is important the coaches they will make a trip, otherwise they let other coaches put their wrestler on the board.

I will look for more states and let you know how the search goes.

[TXUSWOA]

Not to sound like a broken record, but if schools used Trackwrestling for their tournaments throughout the season and for Districts and Regions, there is a way to track the results...

Once a wrestler is entered into the system, every match he or she wrestles is recorded in the system; the results can be pulled and seeding can easily be done based on them!

[jmicheal2333]

http://www.idhsaa.org/sports/wrestling/ ... Manual.pdf page 5
http://www.fhsaa.org/sports/wrestling
http://lhsaa.org/uploads/handbook/Secti ... ling10.pdf
25.8.10 The state tournament’s official seeding meeting (Divisions I, II, and III) shall be the Monday night prior to the state tourna¬ment. The LHSAA shall be notified of any substitutions no later than 4:00 p.m. at the LHSAA office the day of the seeding meeting, or no later than 6:30 p.m. at the seeding meeting. Substitutions shall not be allowed for any reason after 6:30 p.m. the day of the seeding meeting.

http://www.chsaa.org/sports/wrestling/p ... n_2012.pdf Page26

http://www.whsaa.org/stateevents/wrestl ... gional.pdf


Here are some more states that use seeding meeting before the stae tournament. If you wan ta better way to seed the state tournament or regionals, there is a way.

[Goddard84]

FYI. Prep-nationals also seeds its tournament.

[jmicheal2333]

Ideas for seeding at state
state coaches have meeting before tournament to discuss seeding
criteria: top 2 placers at regionals go on board
in no particular order
1.overall winning percentage
2. last years state placement-State champ at same weight, state champ different weight, state placer
3. head to head
*if there was an upset at regionals then coaches can decide together to put wrestler on board based on there criteria.

This avoids most match ups to early in the tournament but will not avoid them all.

That will never happen. THe state is too big to get everybody together for a seeding meeting. The UIL likes to get brackets done so they can make programs, etc. A seeding meeting gets to close to the state tournament date and causes logistical problems. THis is why you see a matrix in almost every state. Are there any states that have a seeding meeting for state? IMO, If the state tournament is seeded, it should be by a point system that is computer generated. YOu have to take bias out of a seeding meeting at the state tournament.

If making a program for the fans is the most important to UIL or coaches then they shouldn't change a thing... “If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got.”

[ChooseBottom]

DBNEWYORK-

I guess we now know what DB Stands for! Why do you have to bring Pierce/Rico into the scenario? Are you kidding! There are far too many instances when the best two wrestlers are on the same side of the bracket at State and this should NOT happen! This is a problem that is easily corrected with a matrix that is used by several other states...

The other problems you address are problems! So DB, YOU got answers? If so then lets hear them! Dont be part of the problem, be part of the solution or quit your bitchn'!

Iron man,
The Pierce/ Rico Match up was brought up in an earlier post that I was responding to. It has since been edited and removed. You seem to know who the best two wrestlers in the state are why don't you rank them. Oh yeah if you were to do that we would have 14 #1 ranked Allen wrestlers. You hold an incredible bias and do not see enough state wide wrestling to make educated decisions on ranking wrestlers. You either minimize or outright disregard any wrestling from outside the Metroplex.
To be fair it is impossible to see enough Wrestling from all over Texas to make an accurate seeding at the State tournament. I am certain you would have ranked Pierce ahead of Walker. Your reasoning of course all the tough competion Pierce faced over the course of the season. For sure he is a great wrestler however not the best in the state of Texas.
For your information I have sat with Peter Contreras on a number of occasions and voiced ligitamate complaints on equity. I sent him a proposal for the last alignment and well each time it fell on deaf ears. I am an active part of finding simple solutions to UIL's continuing incompetence. So if you hear me "bitchn" and don't like it tough.
By the way every one has an answer for a better Matrix but sofar no one has been robbed of a State Championship.

Just curious, where would you rank Allen's returners NB?

[DBNEWYORK]

Ranking the returning Allen wrestlers is a very diffficult task. Hard to say what weight classes they will wrestle. The new UIL alignment 4A/5A makes predictions difficult.
From State results Mason Smout would be ranked first if he remains at that weight class although I am not sure he will beat Atkins again next year. Smout is defensively sound and has really developed a solid motor. I was very impressed with his performance this year especially after getting bounced from the championship bracket last year on very questionable officiating.
AJ Hinkle at 32? I believe this years cut took a real toll on him and I doubt he will be able to do it again. 4th place was a good finish for him this year. I was not particularly impressed however depending on his summer practice he could place again.
I have been told by people I have great respect for, that Bass was the best wrestler in Texas this year. That was before the state tournament. Bass did have a great tounament up to the finals. If he doesn't get the third caution who knows how that one ends. Great finals match by Yang. Bass could be the best wrestler in the State next year. He just has to finish the State tournament better than this year. Scary amount of talent and ability for a sophomore. Vasquez could challenge Bass at the tournament.
Nickal holds two of the most exciting matches at state with his finals match last year against Roberts and this years quarter finals match up with speckles. This one will be tough to pick. He is a solid wrestler but 145 was a tough pull for him last year and since he is wrestling 160 this summer I can not guess where he will be next year. Pretty sure he wrestles for a medal but who knows at what weight.
Pierce at 160 or 152? Either weight I do not see the challenge he faced this year with Walker. I guess the rest of you can decide if Pierce is better than Bass or Bass is better than Pierce.
Meyer will be tough at 70 or 82. No Dorsey at 70 and no Wilson at 82. No idea who challenges Meyer. Was impressed with his improvement on the offensive side. Last year no shots just defense but this year Meyers picks win him a state championship.
Cobb is probably the best wrestler on the Allen Eagles. What better than Pierce? Better than Bass? Well 3 for 3 at the state tournament means he is damn good. Who knows what weight he will com out of football season at? He does not play the skill postion Pierce plays. Cobb will probably be close to 30lbs over the weight he wrestles in the state Tournament. Note to football coaches everywhere. Wrestling is good for football!
Drulman like Smout is sound defensively. He waits for the other wrestler to make a mistake. If he works like Meyer and improves his offense he will be tough to beat.

[ChooseBottom]

Ranking the returning Allen wrestlers is a very diffficult task. Hard to say what weight classes they will wrestle. The new UIL alignment 4A/5A makes predictions difficult.
From State results Mason Smout would be ranked first if he remains at that weight class although I am not sure he will beat Atkins again next year. Smout is defensively sound and has really developed a solid motor. I was very impressed with his performance this year especially after getting bounced from the championship bracket last year on very questionable officiating.
AJ Hinkle at 32? I believe this years cut took a real toll on him and I doubt he will be able to do it again. 4th place was a good finish for him this year. I was not particularly impressed however depending on his summer practice he could place again.
I have been told by people I have great respect for, that Bass was the best wrestler in Texas this year. That was before the state tournament. Bass did have a great tounament up to the finals. If he doesn't get the third caution who knows how that one ends. Great finals match by Yang. Bass could be the best wrestler in the State next year. He just has to finish the State tournament better than this year. Scary amount of talent and ability for a sophomore. Vasquez could challenge Bass at the tournament.
Nickal holds two of the most exciting matches at state with his finals match last year against Roberts and this years quarter finals match up with speckles. This one will be tough to pick. He is a solid wrestler but 145 was a tough pull for him last year and since he is wrestling 160 this summer I can not guess where he will be next year. Pretty sure he wrestles for a medal but who knows at what weight.
Pierce at 160 or 152? Either weight I do not see the challenge he faced this year with Walker. I guess the rest of you can decide if Pierce is better than Bass or Bass is better than Pierce.
Meyer will be tough at 70 or 82. No Dorsey at 70 and no Wilson at 82. No idea who challenges Meyer. Was impressed with his improvement on the offensive side. Last year no shots just defense but this year Meyers picks win him a state championship.
Cobb is probably the best wrestler on the Allen Eagles. What better than Pierce? Better than Bass? Well 3 for 3 at the state tournament means he is damn good. Who knows what weight he will com out of football season at? He does not play the skill postion Pierce plays. Cobb will probably be close to 30lbs over the weight he wrestles in the state Tournament. Note to football coaches everywhere. Wrestling is good for football!
Drulman like Smout is sound defensively. He waits for the other wrestler to make a mistake. If he works like Meyer and improves his offense he will be tough to beat.

Ok there you go an honest guess at what Allen will look like next year. What were you expecting some crazy biased bashing of the Allen team or kids. No I have never had a problem with what the kids do on the mat. I do have a problem with a select group of fans, parents or boosters that fail to see a fair assessment of all the state. I also don't much care for the poor us argument. Why do all the fans and officals and coaches cheer against us. Sure it happens some times but I am certain that most of the time wrestling fans cheer for success of good kids which includes many of those Allen kids.

Looks like a fourth State title is likely to find its way to the halls of Allen HS.
But you can be sure there will be plenty of State champions that have sacrificed just as much and worked just as hard as the Eagle champions and I will recognize their achievements too.

I guess you could read my question again, "Just curious..." Just wanted to know what you thought. You implied that someone else might rank all these kids #1 (or maybe all of them, I can't look back when posting) so wondered what you take was.

"Poor us?" "Officials and coaches cheer against us?" "A fair assessment of the state?" You seem like you want to pick a fight? I didn't ask or imply any of that...

[cwilson]

Ideas for seeding at state
state coaches have meeting before tournament to discuss seeding
criteria: top 2 placers at regionals go on board
in no particular order
1.overall winning percentage
2. last years state placement-State champ at same weight, state champ different weight, state placer
3. head to head
*if there was an upset at regionals then coaches can decide together to put wrestler on board based on there criteria.

This avoids most match ups to early in the tournament but will not avoid them all.

That will never happen. THe state is too big to get everybody together for a seeding meeting. The UIL likes to get brackets done so they can make programs, etc. A seeding meeting gets to close to the state tournament date and causes logistical problems. THis is why you see a matrix in almost every state. Are there any states that have a seeding meeting for state? IMO, If the state tournament is seeded, it should be by a point system that is computer generated. YOu have to take bias out of a seeding meeting at the state tournament.

If making a program for the fans is the most important to UIL or coaches then they shouldn't change a thing... “If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got.”

Like I said, if you are going to seed it, it should be computer generated. Kids should not be seeded based on what somebody thinks. It needs to be a mathematical model free from biased, or just simply separate the regional champs if there is two or more previous placers amongst the regional champs. coaches vote should not be a seeding criteria at the state tournament, and if a bunch of coaches get together, that is exactly what will happen. You will see alliances form, and that is not where we want to go.

Simple separaton of regional champs or a computer generated seeding system still gets the programs printed! That means the UIL is happy, because if the UIL isn't happy, it won't happen.

[cain]

only seed returning placers!!!! easy done...

-Champ 1st seed(more than one, Champ at that wt class
-next highest placer at that class..